What kind of president will you be and what style will you bring to this presidency?
Nicolas Sarkozy: We are in our fifties, but age does not matter. I will try to be a President who is committed to results. I want to take responsibility. I will make commitments and ask to be judged based on these commitments. I want an impeccable Republic. The opposition will have a right to veto.
Ségolène Royal: I want to get France out of the situation it is in. First, the debt, 2 million working poor living below the poverty line, retirees with declining purchasing power, and the deficit in social security. Assaults + 30% more violence. You talked about zero tolerance, but today the French are worried. I want to be the president who will reduce violence but also unemployment, which is social violence. Do you consider yourself partly responsible for the current situation in France?
Nicolas Sarkozy: Yes, I am responsible. If in 2002, the French did not qualify the Prime Minister for the second round, it is because the French considered the PS responsible for this catastrophic situation. In terms of violence, over the 5 years of government, with Jospin + 18% increase in violence, with that of Chirac, it decreases by -10%. But for how long have France’s budgets been in deficit and how to reduce this? We have a historic opportunity to reduce the state budget.
Ségolène Royal: I want to go back to the issue of power. We are in 2007 and not in 2002, two days ago a female police officer was raped. What happened to lead to this? The number of civil servants must not decrease as you just announced. This woman would not have been raped because she would have gone home with a colleague. Not to mention the National Education where many classes will disappear at the start of the next school year. The public will be one of my priorities. Clearly tell the French where you want to cut civil servant positions. I will reform decentralization for the benefit of regionalization. I want to avoid wasting public money through a real reform of the state.
Nicolas Sarkozy: I do not want to argue, but the socialist group has always refused to vote for the police budgets. You spoke of this rape but how to accompany the female civil servants who go home? Regarding sex offenders, none will leave prison without proper treatment, and regarding recidivists, I propose severe sanctions. It is also necessary to resolve the impunity of minors. I propose that a recidivist minor be punished as an adult. As for the hospital, I want to support its staff undermined by the 35-hour workweek; the 35 hours have been a disaster for the French economy.
Ségolène Royal: For the hospital, the 35 hours delight many caregivers. New positions will need to be created because the needs are obvious, for example, to reestablish the hospital in rural areas. To return to the issue of sexual delinquency, which for me has nothing to do with genetics, the urgency is that care be given in prison. An expert committee should sit in prisons; you have been Minister of the Interior, why not have proposed these laws? If elected, closed centers will see the day. I spoke of military supervision for minors, and I will implement it. If there is a response to the first act of delinquency, in 70% of cases there is no recurrence.
To combat the debt, I will make a new pact with businesses to reconcile France with business. I will lower corporate taxes, which will reinvest this tax into the business.
INSTITUTIONS
Nicolas Sarkozy: By discussing all topics, she risks glossing over them.
Ségolène Royal: Let me take responsibility for my statements.
Nicolas Sarkozy: You are right, it is necessary to boost growth. But we work less than others. I want to consider and value work. Will you generalize the 35 hours?
The temptation to relocate is strong, and you will destroy growth. Workforces must be liberated. I will put an end to early retirement to free up the country.
Ségolène Royal: Your law on decentralization is confusing. I want to restore a just order in administration. But to return to work, your proposal is dangerous and ineffective. Certainly, we do not work enough but wouldn’t untaxed overtime discourage hiring? I want to instill confidence in the youth and graduates and propose the creation of 500,000 gateway jobs. Gateway jobs work and cost nothing, while your overtime would cost €5 billion. Employment leads to employment.
EMPLOYMENT
Nicolas Sarkozy: We have the lowest unemployment rate in years. Nowhere in the world have the 35 hours been retained. Salaries are too low as a result, and purchasing power is devalued. The work of some creates work for others. I try to understand and explain to the French our differences. I want 25% extra for overtime hours because they will not be subject to contributions. I would propose two other things; I want to create a single employment service by merging the ANPE and the Assedic and a professional security contract that will allow finding a job or training that I tested with Mr. Borloo in 7 basins of employment.
Ségolène Royal: If you think the 35h have created so much damage, why not have abolished them? During this free time, the French took care of their families. I am for the freedom of those who want to work more. The second law on the 35 hours was too rigid; I know how to be critical, and I said in my presidential pact that all changes will be discussed with social partners.
Nicolas Sarkozy: What will you change about the 35 hours?
Ségolène Royal: Let people work at their pace. You have never questioned the 35 hours. We must renegotiate with social partners to reform this.
There must be real social dialogue. No laws will be imposed in the social field without a discussion with all social actors. Negotiation is essential for the reform of the 35 hours. Your 2 extra hours are not a solution. I prefer to hire a young person or a senior.
Nicolas Sarkozy: You skim over topics with many generalities. I am for the first 4 additional hours at + 25% and from the 5th at 50%. For companies that increase salaries, the state will take over a part of it. I want to make companies that push into early retirement responsible for those in their fifties who can contribute a lot. I want a renewed employment service with rights and duties.
HEALTH, HOUSING, AND RETIREMENT
Ségolène Royal: In my program, it’s win-win. I want to revalue the minimum wage and increase low wages that are the lowest in Europe. I believe in the dynamics of territories, and I want the French to become a nation of entrepreneurs. I waited 2 years to open a biofuel plant in La Rochelle. I want to debureaucratize the state. I want young people to be able to create their businesses, aided by a free loan. I will be the President who will ensure that businesses stay in France, just like our researchers. We must unite research, training, and business.
Nicolas Sarkozy: Modern politics is honesty. We have created competitiveness clusters.
Ségolène Royal: It’s true, but not a single exemption of charges, although promised, has arrived to date.
Nicolas Sarkozy: Regarding special retirement plans, I will reform them upon my arrival at the presidency. I will also finance small pensions. I also want to reform the pensions for reversal by increasing them from 54% to 60%. Regarding housing, I propose a tax credit to boost access to ownership. For health, I want to initiate an Alzheimer’s plan; 1.2 million French will be affected in 10 years. I also want to propose better reimbursements for ophthalmology and dental expenses, which are not a luxury.
Ségolène Royal: How long will your sleight of hand take? I plan to create a tax on stock market profits to truly reform our retirement plans.
Solidarity between our generations is crucial. I am also thinking of women who have raised their children and are disadvantaged when it comes to retirement. Choosing to raise one’s children is also a full-time job and should be valued as a real job. I want those who want to work longer to do so, but I also want to consider the difficulty of tasks. A senior executive does not have the same life expectancy as a worker—a 7-year gap.
For the first time in France, young people are worried about their retirement.
Nicolas Sarkozy: How to finance our retirements? This should not be a political battle; Fillon’s idea is correct. But the difficulty of work will not solve all problems. Revisiting these laws is irresponsible. The financing of retirements is balanced until 2020.
Ségolène Royal: I also want to overhaul the special regimes for parliamentarians.
Nicolas Sarkozy: I agree with you. François Hollande wants to create a CSG; do you agree?
Ségolène Royal: No
Nicolas Sarkozy: He will be glad to hear it. With me as President, we will finance and commit. The Fillon Laws will be there for that. You need financing because you want to abolish these laws.
Ségolène Royal: I never said I wanted to abolish them but to overhaul them.
Nicolas Sarkozy: The problem with France is that we pay too many taxes. If work is too taxed, it goes away. If capital is taxed, it goes away. We cannot impose new taxes on businesses and employees. We need to reduce the state budget and public spending. I propose to tax imports to finance the reduction of these expenses.
Ségolène Royal: What a shame you didn’t do that in recent years. There is a credibility problem. You even forced it with the 49.3.
TAXATION
Ségolène Royal: Tax reform for ecology. I want a development of eco-materials and renewable energies. Taxation is a tool for economic development. 3 million French are poorly housed, and the state will build the quota of social housing, which is not the case in your municipality. I want to create a public service for housing access guarantees.
Nicolas Sarkozy: No one in France should be taxed more than 50% of their income. The purpose of France is not to make creators leave.
ENVIRONMENT
Nicolas Sarkozy: I find it scandalous that we import products in France from countries that do not respect the Kyoto Protocol. I will create taxes on foreign heavy trucks.
If I am President, I will confirm the choice of nuclear power, which is a clean energy. I have proposed a total tax exemption on biofuels. Regarding social housing, it’s important, but the ambition is to have a France of homeowners. I commit to favoring ownership. For inheritance, I plan to abolish inheritance and gift taxes.
Ségolène Royal: The global challenge is one of the most important. We must solve the issue of global warming. Today, France has a poor rating, and I want to make France a good student. My project was rated 16/20 by major environmental associations, while yours received an 8/20. I want a clean vehicle. Do you know the share of nuclear in France’s electricity?
Nicolas Sarkozy: 50%.
Ségolène Royal: Wrong, it is 17%. You just made a series of errors, and you should review your basics in this sector. Uranium will disappear in a few years.
Nicolas Sarkozy: What will you choose, nuclear or not?
Ségolène Royal: I will keep nuclear but will enhance the emergence of new fuels.
Nicolas Sarkozy: I am not for all nuclear but neither for stopping its development.
EDUCATION FAMILY
Nicolas Sarkozy: The problem with school is not just a money problem. What kind of school do we want? I want merit… Like Ferry, ambition for children. Civics and morality. Respect for teachers. A path adapted to problems. Response to teachers’ malaise. All children will be able to stay in supervised study and return with homework done on a voluntary basis. Choice of one’s child’s school. Autonomy of the establishment. Pedagogical freedom, I want the teacher to be judged on his ability to teach and not to apply the latest government circular.
Ségolène Royal: Educational pact. Guarantee of egalitarian promise. A lot of suffering because school violence has increased following the disappearance of many jobs. Public service of early childhood from 3 years old. Individualized tutoring by teachers, tutors, or adults on a voluntary basis. No more programming for failure. Strengthening of education in priority areas. There must be real free and individualized academic support. Scholarship students will be invited to help the most disadvantaged. There is a shortage of culture in schools. When a student fails in writing or reading, he may be able to succeed in theater, sports, or music. I want to bring families and schools closer together because this rapprochement can bring fair authority in order to make all students succeed. 5,000 teaching positions have just been cut; I will repair this next summer.
I don’t want more than 17 students per class and no more “large” middle schools of more than 600 students.
Nicolas Sarkozy: We need individual support and artistic education but also more sports. I wish that families sign the internal regulations and respect them. If a family does not respect this, family allowances must be put under guardianship. I wish that one can become an engineer in the technical track as in the general track. I also want all women to have the right to have their child cared for, and in this regard, I wish that women can appeal to the courts to enforce this right.
Ségolène Royal: What a strange society, going to court to have one’s child cared for!
I prefer effective political action; you are not serious.
Nicolas Sarkozy: I propose 100% reception of disabled children at school, and the enforceable right will be a solution to this.
Ségolène Royal: What I just heard is scandalous. Playing with disability is scandalous.
I had set up assistants, and your government cut these educator positions. You know it perfectly, and the way you just described it to us, with tears in your eyes, is immoral.
Nicolas Sarkozy: You are losing your composure and losing your cool. Ms. Royal dares to use the word immoral. Ms. Royal described my statement as teary-eyed. I would never have allowed myself to speak like that about you. I don’t think you elevate the debate. If I hadn’t talked about disability, you wouldn’t have said anything about it. I do not question your sincerity, do not question my morality.
Ségolène Royal: I am not losing my composure; I am angry. I have kept intact my capacity for revolt.
EUROPE
Ségolène Royal: I want France to return to the European table. I respect the French in their vote, and I think I can unite. Europe must prove itself, and I want to revive the Europe of research and development. We must work together to move upward and not turn to low-wage countries. There must be real social protection like in Spain and Portugal. We must pull European countries upwards.
Nicolas Sarkozy: The French voted no, we will not return to it. We must stop the race towards enlargement. I will oppose Turkey’s entry. We need community preference based on reciprocity. We need a common policy with a simplified treaty; I don’t want a new constitution, the French said no. What is your position on Turkey’s entry?
Ségolène Royal: We need to pause and reflect. A discussion process is underway, and we cannot change that. Conditions are set, if the conditions are met and the French agree, why not. We do not slam the door of Europe on a country.
Nicolas Sarkozy: For 40 years, we have made them believe that they will join Europe one day. This country is in Asia Minor, and enlargement prevents the construction of Political Europe.
INTERNATIONAL
Nicolas Sarkozy: Iran is not dangerous, but its leaders are.
Ségolène Royal: We must ban the enrichment of Uranium since Iran refuses inspections. I want a strict position.
Nicolas Sarkozy: For Darfur, leaders must be held accountable before an international court. The question of Africa is fundamental. I will no longer allow family reunification if one cannot support one’s family. I also want the family to learn French before joining France.
Ségolène Royal: I am for boycotting the Beijing Olympics.
Nicolas Sarkozy: Strange that Ms. Royal is for the boycott of the Olympics when she went to China and even praised the justice of that country.
Ségolène Royal: I went to China to meet French companies. I did not praise Chinese justice but warned French companies to protect their patents and ideas.
UNDocumented
Nicolas Sarkozy: I will not make any global regularization. We have always paid dearly for various regularizations. It must be settled on a case-by-case basis, but France cannot welcome all the misery of the world. We have the right to choose, and those who do not have papers will be sent home.
Ségolène Royal: It is not acceptable to come and arrest a grandfather in front of a school and in front of his grandson. I agree with case-by-case regulation. I prefer to handle things humanely. In any case, I will not arrest a grandfather in front of his grandson and in front of his school. You promised regularization for battered women; did you do it?
Nicolas Sarkozy: I will do it.
Sixth Republic or not?
Nicolas Sarkozy: We must not change the institutions of the Republic. The pseudo-debate between Ms. Royal and Mr. Bayrou is proof of this. It’s curious to ask for a change of institutions when over 80% of the French voted. I want more power for parliament and a real status for the opposition. In the majority, our UDF friends will have their place; I remember that before the first round, Ms. Royal said Bayrou was worse than Sarkozy.
Ségolène Royal: We must deeply reform the institutions. The French have had enough of institutions that do not resemble them. The French will decide by referendum. No more accumulation of mandates, 49.3 will be abolished, and the opposition will be respected in Parliament. I want these institutions to regain their impartiality. A new stage of decentralization to make the state faster. We do not want to see a CPE passed by force with 49.3 then withdrawn by street pressure. We must modernize our institutions with a share of proportionality.
What do you think of each other?
Nicolas Sarkozy: I respect her talent and competence. She is not where she is by chance. Great qualities are needed to represent her party. During this campaign, we set an example. She is more a competitor than an opponent.
Ségolène Royal: Political debate is a debate of ideas. The choice of society that we embody. I believe in the
